Sept 24

Sorry I got late with this one....there's been a LOT going on the last couple days.......God is good! But I love this passage and didn't want to skip by it.

I used to read this and think that this all had to do with end times. It does, but it was also fullfilled amazingly and accurately fullfilled in the second century. Skeptics have alleged that such events were certainly recorded after the fact — the work of a historian and not a prophet. Peter C. Craigie notes the importance of the interpretation of Daniel, as he says, “in the minds of some”:


“The dreams of Daniel, if taken as sixth century productions, clearly and accurately predict the course of Near Eastern history down to the middle of the second century B.C. (at least), and are a testimony to the accuracy of God’s special revelation to Daniel. On the other hand, it is precisely the concurrence between the substance of the visions and the actual history of the Near East which compels other interpreters to claim that the visions must have been written after the events they describe” (The Old Testament: Its Background, Growth and Content, Nashville: Abingdon, 1986, p. 246).


 Really the whole book of Daniel would have had to have been faked because each vision builds on the next (and we know that Jesus himself references the book and that much of Revelation parallels it). In the previous vision we find that the big ram's kingdom is going to be broken up into 4 parts. In this vision, we concentrate just on two of the four parts, the king of the north and the king of the south.

I'm going to give you a cliff note version of what happened. (I encourage you to google a more complete version)  If you see Israel on a map, you realize they are kind of a pathway or road between the modern day nations and Syria and Lebenon to the north and Egypt to the south. A war between these empires would mean marching through Israel, which is exactly what they did. The king of the North (Antiochas Epiphanes) marched against the southern kingdom. (I forget all the names of the empires- Ptomames and Sulucids or something like that-I regret I dont' have time to be more accurate, but the info is out there). Upon marching to the south, Rome sails into to fight with the south and the north is turned back- marching again through Israel. They have no spoils or booty or anything to pay the soldiers with and they raid the temple. They set up sacrifices to greek gods and even slaughter pigs on the alters (especially detestable to Jews). Finally, there is the Maccabean revolt and the temple is retaken. It has to be rededicated and there is only enough oil for one day and the dedication much last 8 days. And it does. Thus the celebration of Hanakah (which Jesus himself attended by the way John 10:22)

Clearly this sacrificing a pig on the alter would have been thought of as the 'abomination that causes deslotation'. However, Jesus warns his disciples (and us) of the 'abominoation that causes desolation' in the end times. So clearly, even though a lot of this passage was fulfilled, (so much so that unbelievers cannot accept it was written beforehand), we are not done with this prophesy. (I wonder if the diciples were sitting around with their mouths hanging open thinking- "I thought this happened already!" Matthew 24:15.

I wanted to go into a lot more depth about this, but if I don't leave google alone, I will never get this published and it's already a couple days late. Until recently, I've never heard a word on this subject in all my years of church. And it's such a cool subject. But I can't see how it does not fit in a '3 point outline' of a sermon. Keep learning and searching on your own! Don't take my word for anything...search it out!

Sept 22

I put an addendum on yesterday's blog and if you receive this by eamil or don't visit our Chronological Bible site, you may have missed it. If you follow the link that I posted, it takes you to a site by endtimepilgrim and there is a youtube video that helps explain Daniel's 70 sevens and a how it fits exactly with Jesus presenting himself as Messiah. I tried to watch the other associated videos and got on some weird ones (you tube just throws all 'associated videos' together). So, if you watch it, and I reccomend that you do, make sure you stay on the Gavin Finley ones. It's been suprisingly difficult to find a theologially sound site to link to. I checked out all this guys doctrinal statement and went to his bio. I feel it is all sound. Here is a link that puts all the 70 Seven videos in order (bottom of the page) http://endtimepilgrim.org/70wks1.htm
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I just love Daniel (my son and the book :)! He had lived through all these rulers, had been shown these awesome visions, read that captivity was about to end and had been shown the end of times. Ah, Jerusalem will be restored....maybe in his lifetime....maybe he will return himself......in any case just a few more years of this Babylon nonesense........smooth sailing from here.........NOT!! The unchangable decree comes down-anyone who prays to any god but the king will be thrown in the lions den. Hey- that wasn't the plan!

We don't have any experience with unchangable decrees. Any law can be bent, broken, changed or rewritten in our modern culture -even the 'unchangable' ones (like royals are not allowed to divorce).  But in these days a king could not even change his own decree. Daniel knows that nothing is going to get him out of this. There will be no last minute appeal or pardon.  So......he panics and starts praying in secret. NOT. He does what he's always done....prays three times a day toward Jerusalem. If the prayer we read yesterday is any indication, he is a powerful intercessor. I tend to think that he was praying that same type of prayer of confession of national and personal sin that he had done previously. I would have been temped to start out something like, "hey you remember my buddy Gabriel? If he's not too busy.....could you send him to me again?? I'm in a tough stop here!!"

I think this comes in a fitting place after talking about beasts and empires and tribulation and end times. It can be easy to be frightened by it all. But Daniel trusted God and the God he served shut the mouth of the beasts. Not a wound was found on him. And in the end, the ones who are indeed devoured by the beasts (lions in this case) are the ones who tried to harm him in the first place.

Sept 21 with addendum

Vast numbers of books have been written on Daniel 9 and his Seventy Sevens. I will show you how the dates may work out "to the very day" from the decree to rebuild Jerusalem until Christ comes riding into Jerusalem on Palm Sunday. First a few exciting points to ponder. I can't possible do it justice, but we'll give it a whirl here. This will be a long one. Hang in there! (I won't even touch on the hand writing on the wall...there is so much to comment on!)

Daniel, at his ripe age of 80 something, having spent most of his life in captivity in Babylon and having only very distant memories of beloved Israel, searches the scriptures and finds exciting news. Only a few more years of captivity are left! (Jer 25:8-12 and Jer 29:8-14). This drives Daniel immediately to prayer of confession for his people. I found a marvelous modern day equivelant of his prayer by Minster Joe Wright who was asked to open the Kansas Senate in prayer:

Heavenly Father, we come before You today to ask Your forgiveness and seek Your direction and guidance. Lord, we know Your Word says, "Woe to those who call evil good," but that's exactly what we've done. We have lost our spiritual equilibrium and inverted our values.
We confess that we have ridiculed the absolute truth of Your Word and called it moral pluralism.
We have worshipped other gods and called it multi-culturalism.
We have endorsed perversion and called it an alternative lifestyle.
We have exploited the poor and called it the lottery.
We have neglected the needy and called it self-preservation.
We have rewarded laziness and called it welfare.
We have killed our unborn and called it choice.
We have shot abortionists and called it justifiable.
We have neglected to discipline our children and called it building esteem.
We have abused power and called it political savvy.
We have coveted our neighbors' possessions and called it ambition.
We have polluted the air with profanity and pornography and called it freedom of expression.
We have ridiculed the time-honored values of our fore-fathers and called it enlightenment.
Search us oh God and know our hearts today; try us and see if there be some wicked way in us; cleanse us from every sin and set us free.
Guide and bless these men and women who have been sent here by the people of Kansas, and who have been ordained by You, to govern this great state. Grant them Your wisdom to rule and may their decisions direct us to the center of Your will. I ask it in the name of Your Son, the Living Savior, Jesus Christ.

Wow! He thought he might get a 'call or two' about his prayer. His staff quit counting at 6,500 (overwhelmingly positive).

Daniel got an even more overwhelming response to his prayer- a visit from Gabriel! (at the 'time of the evening sacrifice' which was 3pm, the same time that Jesus died-by the way). While Daniel is focused on the restoration of the Lord's desolate sanctuary and city in 7 years, God brings him a message of SEVENTY sevens.

It is not expounded on in the text, but we are not told that Daniel is confused and ill this time by the vision. I presume he understands the whole thing (he is told 3 times to understand it). A lot has to happen these seventy sevens (or 490 years)

• Daniel's people and holy city (Israelites and Jerusalem) finish trangression (do the words 'It is finished" ring in your mind?)
• put an end to sin
• atone for wickedness
• bring in everlasting righteousness
• seal up vision and prophecy 
• annoint the most holy

( Of course, it is difficult to imagine that we have an end to sin since we are still living in a sinful world. But Jesus did atone for it and pay the penatly and cancel it's power by bringing His righteousness).Daniel is told some more specifics about the timing. Jerusalem will be rebuilt first, but in times of trouble (see Nehamiah). And "from the issuing of the decree to restore and build Jerusalem until the Anointed One, it will be seven 'sevens' and sixty two 'sevens'". That makes 69 sevens or 483 years. The decree given by king Ataxerxes in Nehemiah 2 in March 14,445BC + 483 prophetic years brings us to April 6, 32 AD. *It is on that day that Jesus rode into Jerusalem on a donkey (in fulfillment of Zech 9:9).  They should have known this was all in fulfillment of prophecy:
 Luke 19:41-44 As he approached Jerusalem and saw the city, he wept over it and said, "If you, even you, had only known on this day what would bring you peace—but now it is hidden from your eyes. The days will come upon you when your enemies will build an embankment against you and encircle you and hem you in on every side. They will dash you to the ground, you and the children within your walls. They will not leave one stone on another, because you did not recognize the time of God's coming to you."

 (See the chart larger on the website with video explaination* and yes, I checked their doctrinal statement)

Daniel goes on to learn that after all this the Annointed One will be cut off and will have nothing. I've read that the Hebrew word used here is 'karath'. I means to cut down or kill and is the same word used in Lev 7:27 for the death penalty and also 'cutting' a covenant. And of course, that is exactly what happened to the Annointed One. That takes care of 69 or the 70 sevens. Many people know feel we are living in what they call the 'gap period'. Between the 69th and 70th week. Then in the last and final seven is the tribulation. It is a lot to try and comprehend! There is even more in the text but we will try to touch on some of it as we study Jesus quoting Daniel in the NT.

http://endtimepilgrim.org/70wks6.htm
*I can't make the math work myself (but I rarley can make math work!) I'll point you to this website that explains it I've seen others work it with a 444 BC date for the declaration and a 33 AD Palm Sunday date. No matter how you figure it, the Messiah has ALREADY COME!!


ADDENDUM: If you follow this link and watch the youtube video associated with it, you may realize that it is "part 4" and you may see a lot of other youtube videos at the end and try to watch the other parts. I accidently got on a Seventh Day Adventist video. If you try to watch the other videos in THIS series (and I high reccomend that you do!) make sure it is from GAVIN FINLEY. It has been really hard to find a site to link to that is theologically sound, so don't get lost!! If you start at the beginning of the videos, it all makes sense (even to my math challenged brain!!)

Sept 20

Meanwhile back at the ranch.......back to Daniel! I'm glad that the author included that little bit of history about who the rulers were. He lasted through a lot of rulers!

I had what I thought was a pretty good idea for a blog today. I've seen lots of great charts and graphs that explain these two chapters quite well and compare them to the beasts in the Revelation etc. While the charts themselves were good, the remainder of the these sites had very questionable material. Actually, this may be a good place to put in some warnings. When I got interested in prophecy (I don't get that deep into because my brain does not retain it-but I am interested) I watched a long series of videos on the internet by Doug Batchelor. Things go along great for a looonnng time and he sounds theologically sound until you get a really into and you start going 'whaaat??'. Nowhere does it disclose that it is from the Seventh Day Adventists. A LOT of the prophecy websites out there are run by Seventh Day Adventists. If you find a site, often (but not always) if you look under 'about us' or something similar it will disclose it but not always. Everything can sound VERY plausible. But unless you believe that Pope is going to be the anti-christ (I'm over simplifying because I don't remember all the details- but their interpretation of prophecy has a LOT to do with the Catholic Church) then don't go down this road. Other common prophecy sites are associated with the Jehovah's Witnesses and the Church of Christ (which I tried to read their doctrinal statement because I thought that I remembered that they instist on baptism for salvation and I came away so confused that I didn't know what they believe). Just a word of caution. Google is not an 'easy fix' to figuring these things out.

Trying to figure all this out can be a headache! Poor Daniel, who was known to be a gifted interpreter of dreams was clueless, ill and exhausted! So if you are confused- give yourself a break. Even after Gabriel explained it, Daniel was said it was beyond understanding. We now have the benifit of seeing how history played out and how it fits absolutely perfectly with the vision. 

Most of the prophecies that we have read about have aready come to pass. Of course, each of these animals represent a kingdom. For example, the goat with the large horn is Alexander the Great who swiftly conquered the known world. The horn that breaks into 4, represents the four generals that his kingdom was given to when he died at the age of 33. The tricky part is that it seems to also be refering to the time of the end, so this may have just been a little preview of 'coming attractions'. Also the 4th kingdom has not been fully realized. Most people believe that this will be a revived Roman Empire or that it has something to do with the European Union. Another theory is that it is a confederation of Islamic states and the long awaited Islamic Messiah (the 12th Imam) will be the eventual anti-christ. Everything that I have heard about this theory is very compelling and actually makes the most sense to me (for what that is worth).

For further info on Daniel's visions I suggest watching Perry Stone on you tube. I haven't watched them all, but I have watched enough of him over the years to feel confident in his theology. He is a 'revived Roman Empire' guy however.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4QLX5AMZJwk  This is the link for the first video, there are 8 all together.

Keep in view a very important point when trying to figure all this out- desite all the beasts and other craziness: "BUT THE SAINTS OF THE MOST HIGH WILL RECEIVE THE KINGDOM AND WILL POSSESS IT FOREVER, YES, FOR EVER AND EVER. Daniel: 7:18 (Bottom line- if you are on Jesus team- you win!)

Sept 17

If you watched the "Redeemer" video that I posted (Nichole C. Mullen) a few days ago, much of the verses come from today's reading where God speaks. ("Who told the ocean you can only come this far".........)

As God reviews all His creation with creation with Job, one stuck out a me. Job 39:9 "Will the wild ox consent to serve you? will he stay by your manger at night?" I wondered if this was forshadowing of the Messiah and the way He was born. I couldn't find any commentary to back it up. Just a thought. Some versions say 'unicorn' which people say might be a rhino but as far as I know, a rhino doesn't eat from a manger, so wild ox seems more logical to me.

The other interesting thing to me is that Job 41 decribes a seriously large reptile! I can't think of any modern animal that it would equate with offhand. Certainly sounds like a dinosaur to me! Even people who do not believe the Bible is the Word of God would have a hard time explaining how ancient literature so perfectly describes what would call a dinosaur.

The most awesome thing about this passage, however, is trying to imagine the awe the Job must have felt as God spoke. I can't help thinking about how the Cowardly Lion was all blustery and tough talking when they were going to see the Wizard. And the first time the "Wizard" spoke, the Lion got so scared he jumped through the window. A humorous example, but you get the idea. Job felt like dust compared to God. But, even though (as the author points out) all our questions are not completely answered, eventually everything is put right. Job's friends are rebuked (imagine how they must have felt!!) and Job's former wealth and prosperity are restored even greater than before. He got double for his trouble :)

Sept 16

Job 32-37. Sometimes the lesson is simpler than  you think- (and it's one I am struggling to learn myself). You just need to shut up! Enter a new charachter in the drama: Elihu. To his credit he has listened to all the arguments and has listened well. He even quotes Job on some occasions. He just cannot contain himself- it's finally his turn to speak. He had to wait until everyone older than him was done and now he goes for it. Like the others, he doesn't really say anything that one would consider 'terrible theology'. Except for the fact that suffering is not always a punishment and meant to get your attention, nothing any of the say is "wrong" per se.

But Elihu doesn't really bring anything new to the party. Just more of the same endless stuff. The only thing that I can think to say, is something that I should say to myself more often: Shut Up Already. Does anyone think to try to help Job in any sort of a practical way? Not that I can see. Just talk torture to add salt to the wound. Hopefully, we never have to suffer like Job. But there are a lot of good lessons. The one that screams at me today is SHUT UP! And so I think I shall (for now :)

Sept 15

Who could we possibly compare Job to (prior to his suffering) ? Not only was he the wealthiest, best thought of, most respected man of his time- we find in today's reading that he was also one of the most giving and compassionate men ever. He looked after the poor, he was the champion of the downtrodden and oppressed, he was always fair with his servants...Everyone respected him and waited to hear what he had to say. The only human example I can even come up with is Oprah. (Disclaimer- I am neither a fan or a follower and I know that she mixes a lot of religions and calls it Christianity but is not a follower of Christ the Living God). Imagine if she lost her empire. Everything. She is a bum on the streets of Chicago begging beside other smelly bums. At one time, her money and efforts had fought for these homeless people....and now she was among them. Begging. Do they come to her in comfort and thank her for her past efforts? Take her in and protect her? No they mock her, reject her and insult her. Gail, Steadman and Obama settle in ring side seats to endlessly philosophize about her troubles and never lift a finger to help. TV networks and talk shows she once owned now broadcast footage of her in her humbled state. That's what we have here in the this in the story of Job. But even more so, because he was a truly righteous, God fearing and upirght man. Every day the depth of his anguish becomes more real to me and is like a 'punch in the gut'.


On a side note, in today's reading, I was curious about what it meant in about 'cutting Rahab into pieces' in Job 26:12. I was relieved to find out that it was not refering to Rahab the prositute who hid the spies. It actually has a different spelling in Hebrew and refers to storms and evil forces. It's used several times in scripture- several of which we have already read. Apparently I didn't notice it before.

Today's reading was long...it is easy to skim it. I would encourage you to read Job 28 again. Soak in the beauty of the verse  leading up to the last familiar verse: "The fear of the Lord-that is wisdom, and to shun evil is understand". Great stuff.

Sept 14

One thing that has struck me about reading Job this time that I have never noticed is that he apparently has other family and friends. Job 19:13-20 talks about how his brothers are alienated from him, his aquintances estranged, his servants no where to be found. His intimate friends dispise him, his kinsman have left him. Almost always in every tragedy we hear people say "At least I have ___________(my kids, my parents, my church family- whatever; fill in the blank". But EVERYONE has turned on Job. Ealier in the chapters, there are illusions to his father too. Where is he now??

With absolutley everything and everyone against him, Job is still able to say, "I treasured the words of his mouth more than my daily bread" Job 23:12. He truly had so much of God's Word in him before all this struck, that it was able to sustain him.

Sept 13

Every day in the reading of Job, amidst the annoying friends and endless monologues there is a beautiful treasure. Today's is HUGE. It seems in the midst of Job's suffering and longings God gives him a prophecy. I'm not sure in the midst of his suffering that he even recognizes it as a prophecy. But he has a very keen aweness of how things will be in the distant future. And I'm sure that is what kept him going and it's the same for us today! I marvel at the whole passage- Job 19:25-27
 I know that my Redeemer lives, and that in the end he will stand upon the earth.
26 And after my skin has been destroyed,
yet  in  my flesh I will see God;
27 I myself will see him
with my own eyes—I, and not another.
How my heart yearns within me!
It's hard to express how profound this is. It's thought to be one of the earliest works of scripture and yet Job knows that he will stand with his Redeemer, on the earth after he has died (presumably in the Mellenium).

When we were in Seattle one time, we got to watch a long running Passion Play. We were lucky that Nichole C. Mullen was there that day as a special guest. As dusk decended on the play and Christ was crucified, she sang her song, "Redeemer". At the point where she belts out "I KNOW my Redeemer lives" the hillside lit up with angels and Christ arose. It was really, really awesome. It won't be the same, but enjoy her youtube video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9p4G2GbPYQA

Sept 12 (revised)

(I accidently 'published' instead of 'previewed' this before I was done, so if you got this by e-mail and it sounded half done it was :)

I have a confession- I peeked ahead. We will be done read Job on Sept 18th. Yup- I confess- I'm not into Job. Like I said, there is a ton of great stuff there. But, it's such an interuption to the story line we were on. I'm not good at that :) But, like I also said, that's how suffering is......an interuption of the plan.


I honestly don't know how Job doesn't use what last little bit of strength he has left to strangle these 3 'friends'. I work 12 hr shifts in a small unit and can seldom leave the area. If you have a personality conflict with someone you spend 12 hrs with, it can seem like an eternity. (Most of my colleages are fabulous- but I've been at this for 30 years- so I've worked with a lot of people!). Sometimes they NEVER shut up! You couldn't get a word in edge wise if you paid for it! Or worse yet, you have something important to say or ask, and they have already made up their mind what you are going to say and they don't want to hear. You get the 'talk to the hand' treatment.

Job has to listen to these guys tell him that he must have sinned to have caused all this for MONTHS! After that much badgering and in his weakened and suffering position, I'm suprised that he didn't lose it and falsely confess just to shut them up! His three friends started out with a great idea- they left their homes in order to comfort him and sypmathize with him. Job 2:11-13. They felt so bad for him they just sat with him for 7 days and didn't say a word. And then it started. Talk, talk, talk, talk, talk, talk, talk........

 I'm pretty sure I would have blown at this point and said, "Will you SHUT UP!!". Job does struggle but he never loses it totally. I think that this is because of what I talked about yesterday- he keeps his focus on God. Amazing.

I also like in this chapter how he still has a gut belief that somehow, somewhere, Someone to be an advocate, an intercessor. In the previous readings, he pleads for such a One. In chapter 16, it's as though he sees Him by faith.

19 Even now my witness is in heaven; my advocate is on high.
20 My intercessor is my friend
as my eyes pour out tears to God;
21 on behalf of a man he pleads with God
as a man pleads for his friend.

It's so easy on this side of the cross to take this advocacy for granted. We need an Advocate! God is more than love, He is also justice and holiness and the fact that Jesus Christ has taken our punishment and become our personal advocate in heaven is mind blowing. We have what Job could only long for and cling to by faith.